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EDITED TO INCLUDE BETTER DUELING SETUP This post is revised and reposted submitted by
from last week's "Buildcraft Saturday" post, but since I've been putting up the builds I've been making lately, such as my ultimate pyromancer
and ultimate frostburn
guides, I thought I'd add this one to the mix.
At the request of the extremely helpful and inventive lanzevedo
, I have been trying to compose an ideal archer build (I call mine a "ranger" since he relies more on melee than what lanzevedo ultimately went with). He had three goals for this build:
- Fun to play, regardless of challenge
- Relies either primarily or exclusively on archery
- Optimization through versatility rather than min-maxing for one particular weapon
As I got more involved in the particulars, I decided that rather than speculating, it would be more fun to simply make the build myself and try out different options to see what works best. Here is what I came up with.
Spoilers here are relatively minor, but as always, turn back if you are especially spoiler-averse. So I've been helping a friend with a full-on archer build, and tried it myself so that I could mess around with it. Turns out, it's a really, really fun way to play if you're looking for a new build to try out.
WHAT YOU WILL NEED
Starting class should be either thief or mercenary. I like the mercenary because it starts with the my headgear of choice, the sellsword twinblades (which carry me until I can get my Gotthards), higher dexterity, and an attunment slot for iron flesh.
Many, however, choose the thief because he begins the game with a shortbow. He also begins with an attunment slot as well. It doesn't take long to get a short or composite bow though, so I dob't see that as a tremendous advantage. Both of their starting swag can be gained very early on in the game, so pick your poison.
THINGS YOU MIGHT NEED
- Short or Composite bow (your choice)
- Black Bow of Pharis
- Onislayer Greatbow
- Hunter's Ring
- Carthus Milk Ring
- Hawk Ring
- Prisoner's Chain Heavy Arrows, Dragonslayer Great Arrows
BREAKING DOWN THE STATS
- A melee weapon that performs well with sharp infusion (more on that later)
- Chloranthy ring, ring of favor, ring of steel protection, Lloyd's sword/shield rings, Leo ring, hornet ring, obscuring ring, slumbering dragoncrest ring, knight's ring, all stoneplate rings, Carthus blood ring, silvercat ring (all ideally max level versions if possible).
- Pyromancy glove
- Iron Flesh
- Iron Round shield (the thief starts with this also) or Lleweylln shield. Infuse with either blessed or simple.
- Knight's crossbow/arbalest/avelyn (your choice, more below)
- Lots of crossbow bolts, preferably lightning bolts if you choose the knight's crossbow
- Lots of resins and other consumables due to lack of spell-based buffing
Obviously, this build can be done a handful of different ways, and I'll go over some of them at the bottom. First, though, let me explain why I made my character the way I did.
STRATEGIES FOR PLAYING THIS BUILD IN PVE/CO-OP
- VIG: 27 (22 without PC). This is about as low as you can feasibly go, but since you're a ranged character and won't be getting hit as often, it's not really necessary to take this into higher ranges.
- ATN: 12 (base). It's enough for one spell. Use iron flesh or spook, whatever suits you best.
- END: 25 (30 with PC). 40 is almost always best, but again, the fact that you are a ranged character does not necessitate nearly as much dodging and rolling. You can pump this to 40 if you want to go into the metas, but I prefer staying lower for invasions and co-op, rather than dueling.
- VIT: 25 (30 with PC). You are going to be carrying around a lot of shit. All six of your weapons spots will be filled. You've got three bows in your right hand, and some combination of melee weapon, shield, catalyst, or crossbow in the left. The extra raw defense the stat provides doesn't hurt either, and helps make up for some of the squishiness caused by your low vigor. If you feel like running around naked, though, you can always opt to leave this lower.
- STR: 18, for the Onislayer. Yes, I know all bows are technically two-handed, and that 12 is actually the minimum requirement. But the scaling on this weapon is strange, and 18 strength is the optimal point to reach to get the best damage out of it.
- DEX: 72 (80 with Hunter's ring and Carthus Milk ring). This is the fabled and glorious true DEX softcap. Your black bow of Pharris will be a monster at this level, and your melee weapons well be ultra-formidable. If you're going to main DEX, then you main DEX all the way to the top and tell all your whack-ass Giant Dad friends to eat shit and make a new build for Christ's sake.
- INT: 10, base. You can use spook or iron flesh with it. Neither scale. No need to go higher. We're playing Robin Hood here, not Harry Potter.
- FTH: 8, also base. Leave the prayers to people who actually take damage. If their god loved them so much, he would have made their offensive miracles useful for something.
- LCK: 9, base. Luck is for people with no skill. We can knock a knight off a bridge from 400 yards. We won't be needing it, but thanks anyway.
OK. Your short or composite bow is going to be your most important tool. Why? Don't they have shitty scaling and mediocre range? Well, yeah, they do, and that's why you're not sniping things with them (that's what Pharis and Oni are for).
No, the reason these bows are so important is because they have an attack no other bow in the game does—a rolling shot. So you can dodge so poor fool's slow attack and still land an arrow before you're even off the ground. Both bows' WA is a rapid fire, so holding L2 lets you squeeze off on playa haters like Biggie Smalls. If Biggie were a Dark Souls player, he'd use rapid fire. It is a virtual certainty. This is your up-close game, for when you need to put some hollow points in a hollow soldier and you want to make sure he knows it was you.
I compared the two, and at 18 STR (optimal for the oni, since you get the 1.5x STR scaling multiplier since all bows are used with two hands) and 80 DEX, a fully upgraded composite bow outdamages a fully upgraded short by 3 points. But the shortbow weighs a pound and a half less, so whether the marginal difference in weight is worth the three points in damage is really up to you. I like composite if only because when you're swapping bows on the fly, its icon makes it easier to tell apart from Pharis.
Pharis has a B in DEX fully upgraded, so this becomes your sniping tool from afar. You won't need to be rolling around when you've got the high ground, so this is what you use to pick off your foes from a safe distance. The scaling is superior, and the hawk ring will make up for its somewhat lower range (compared to, say, the longbow), so that 80 DEX will make your shots count.
Oni, on the other hand, can unload damage like crazy, and is the lightest greatbow and also the only one the prioritizes DEX scaling. It's the weakest one, but since it's mostly a backup tool for us, that's just fine. Combine it with Dragonslayer greatarrows and you can knock down any human-sized enemy in the game, or send them hurtling off cliffs or bridges, which, honestly, is hysterical.
I keep all flasks orange but one. Use your simple shield or blue flask to recover FP when sniping. If you choose to forego the shield entirely, then you may want two blue flasks. The blue flask(s) is for emergencies, and you shouldn't need it very often. I also swap hawk ring out for chloranthy+3, favor+3, or Lloyd's sword/shield rings, depending on the situation, since you won't always need the range extension.
Iron Flesh is for when you need to trade with another ranged enemy that you know you can outdamage, but keep having your shot interrupted by. It's also useful when you need to switch to melee and cut through a swarm of enemies, since your poise is pretty garbage. Since this spell is so situational, I often trade the pyro flame out for a simple Llewellyn shield to recover FP from doing either Pharis's triple shot (when sniping larger targets), short/composite's rapid fire (often), oni's puncturing arrow (rarely), or Gotthard's WA L2>R2>R2 combo (a lot).
For arrow slots, I main large arrows in slot one (you can swap to whatever element a given enemy/boss is weak to, or poison arrows for assholes you don't want to deal with), and dragonslayer arrows in 2 (for the oni—these have the best knockback).
Gotthard twins can easily be replaced by any DEX weapon, really. You can use Lothric Knight sword, sellsword twinblades, or warden twins with carthus rouge. I just love the range and scaling of the GTS and they excel over the other options for me. The movesets are very similar for all three, but the ability to dual wield when I switch to melee makes them better than LKS on this build for me, and the reach is better than sellswords with comparable damage. Warden's do slightly less base damage but have bleed, so with carthus rouge, they slaughter anything weak to it. I main the gotthard's in the left hand but use warden's for bleed-weak bosses like dancer, demon princes, and the final TRC boss. But really, use what you're most comfortable with. Any curved sword (like Pontiff, Carthus, or follower sabre) can also parry when used in the left hand, so if you're a parry-fiend, you may prefer these options. IMHO, it's hard as shit to land a parry with these compared to the Llewellyn's excellent start-up frames, though, so I try to use all three of my left hand slots for things none of the other options can do. But you can also use a spear or rapier too—crow quills is the best option there in my opinion, since it gives you a versatile 2H moveset and also does silly counter damage. If you do this, put the Leo ring in the chloranthy/favohawk rotation. Hornet will do you no good with most weapons because they cannot crit in the left hand, but since 2H the quills places the rapier in your hands, you can still maximize on those backstabs if you want.
For those who do nor know, you can 2H your left hand weapon by holding triangle for a second, so this lets you quickly switch between bow mode and melee mode. This is going to be an important skill, since most weapons are pretty useless 1H in the left—this is why I prefer paired weapons; they all scale well with DEX when sharp infused, and they are all fast so using resins for buffs makes the flat AR bonus stack faster, since it does so on each hit. They are also all great for crowd control, which is when you're really going to need them.
Pro-tip: Switching from two-handing a bow to two-handing a paired weapon in the left hand takes some getting used to, but with 80 dex and some practice, you will be a fucking animal. The damage is absolutely absurd. Basically, if you're holding the bow, press triangle once, then HOLD triangle for a half-second or so and now you'll have your twin-swords paired up. When you want to go back to your bow, just tap triangle twice and your bow will be all queued up again.
OTHER IDEAS/VARIATIONS TO TRY/HOW TO BETTER OPTIMIZE THIS FOR PVP
You don't necessarily need to go 80 DEX, but I wanted to be an archer and be able to switch over to pure DEX melee character on one build, and maximize the damage on both. I also intended on this build being used for PvE and cooperative purposes, so obviously that necessitates some changes if you want to duel.
In truth, most bow scaling craps out at 55 DEX, so the climb to 80 benefits the melee weapons far more than the ranged ones. You could make this a quality build if you wanted, to get a little more damage out of Oni and composite, but there really isn't much point and you are giving up your sharp twin weapons.
One idea for going quality is to try and implement my frost/fire strategy using the Pontiff Knight Curved Sword in the left hand and fire arrows on your bow. Use the PKCS WA to inflict frost, then hit them with triple shot spread or rapid fire barrage of fire arrows to reset the meter. I haven't tried this yet, but if anyone does, I'd love to hear some thoughts!
Lastly, some of the other rings I listed above can come in handy situationally as well, particularly in PvP, where combining hawk/slumbering, and obscuring can allow you to snipe opponents from very far away without them knowing where you are. The spell "spook" can also help, should you trade out your glove/iron flesh for it and use a staff offhand instead. Lloyd's sword ring is great for boosting your damage while you're sniping, since you're safely out of range and can easily maintain full health to keep the bonus going. Lloyd's shield is also great for keeping you from getting one-shot in tough boss battles.
MY IDEA FOR OPTIMIZED 1v1 PVP:
I'll be honest here. I am not a dueler by nature. I much prefer to play alongside other players or to invade them, where the chaos adds to the fun and there are plenty of environmental hazards and tricks you can utilize in the anything-goes world of "You Have Been Invaded By Dark Spirit dannypdanger."
That being said, here is my idealized version of the build that I would use if I were to use this setup for dueling. I welcome any suggestions to the contrary and will update the OP with any other builds anyone is kind enough to provide, giving credit where it is due.
That's all I got! Hope it helps!
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This is spurious, but I'll try to keep it short and orderly. Terms and definitions
"Privacy" seems to break into different categories, based on distribution of information.
- A "Personal" piece of information might be something that is never distributed (eg, you might never tell your wife/husband about a pimple next to your anus, even if it made sitting uncomfortable)
- "Intimate" information may only be distributed to one or two other people (a sexual fantasy to a wife/husband),
- "Social" info may go to a select social group (sexual exploits to close friends, but not coworkers- even close ones), or be distributed based on a certain criteria (howto avoid mentioning bigoted jokes?)
- "Institutional" information is information you would want known to (or hidden from) an explicitly defined group, such as a company employing you (your drug habits), a religion you adhere to or are otherwise affected by (your sexual preferences or exploits), a government in authority over you (your contraband possessions or contradictory ideology), or a club or organization you are a member of (your membership in an organization asserted to be incompatible-like being in PETA and The Official Bacon Fan Club).
- "Public" information is available to everybody, at least in theory and in general.
Anonymity also seems worth discussing. You might yell an insult from a crowd since it would be difficult to identify who had said it, or you might say things under a different name that you wouldn't if people you knew might be able to identify you as the speaker.
Morality I define here as 'an objective assessment of the state of a situation on the basis of the effect on happiness, well being, and self-determination to assess and seek happiness and well-being, made for all affected recognizably salient conscious entities, with greater weight given to greater salient consciousness'.
Freedom I define here as "self-determination which may or may not contradict the intentions or desires of others, but which exists without reference to those intentions and desires, without limit, but in acknowledgement of the capacity and freedom of others to seek redress for real or perceived harm", or more simply, "the right to do whatever you want, no matter what anybody thinks, even if it hurts somebody: with the acknowledgement that others have the right to do what they want no matter what you
want, even if it hurts you
"Profit" I'm defining here as "tangible value gained by an exertion by you or on your behalf". I'll use it to talk about money, generally, since it's the standard medium of exchange for most of the world, but I don't mean money exclusively, and some reference might be given to actual versus expected gain and so on. Profit necessarily creates value for more than one individual, because all profit is created by exchange between individuals on the basis of receiving greater value than is invested.
So, that bit's out of the way: now the actual thoughts. Actual thoughts
Humans as a whole needs to be profitable in order to provide for all humans, and the inability to do so creates problems of scarcity that lead to sub-optimal conditions for well-being and happiness for some or most humans, either by necessary commodities being unavailable (famine, drought, drug shortages, fuel shortages, power shortages, lack of facilities for transport and communication), by the means of exchange being insufficiently distributed among the humans that rely on them to obtain those necessary commodities, by restrictions being placed on those commodities (religious injunctions and commands, political or institutional restrictions, social taboos), and by competition between humans and the conditions that arise from this.
Humans who do not profit from others must find a way to create profit for themselves: they must assess their own needs and desires, their capacity for investing themselves in an enterprise (by working, for example) and the potential for return that this investment carries (payment for work, profit margin on trades, shared profits resulting from enabling others to profit to a greater extent than they could have without the investment of others, et al). These assessments must necessarily consider costs, such as being unhappy in a job you hate but which pays well, and risks- such as injury in a dangerous job, loss of goods to be traded by accident or theft, an investment flopping and producing no profit.
People are smart enough to know what to do and what not to do (with exceptions). Every adult human alive is almost certainly in the best position to assess their own desires, happiness, well-being, capacities, and opportunities. Examples of the effectiveness of people at knowing what to do without instruction abound, and some of the most successful enterprises in history have been successful on this basis: Google facilitates this partially with a "20% time" allowance, Valve software exists as a company with absolutely no management structure at all, and Warren Buffet has become rich by enabling people capable of making excellent decisions to do so to a greater capacity than they could have alone.
Privacy matters because individuals must process information without interference in order to come to accurate and useful conclusions. You might pop the zit on your ass and wash more thoroughly and more often, but being told to wash more often to prevent zits on your ass when you had none would be met with skepticism- and being forced to do so would be met with resentment or resistance, no matter how passive, and a greater difference in privacy level would mean a greater chance that the interference would be meaningless or detrimental.
Anonymity matters because people need to be able to meaningfully inform their decisions without others affecting those decisions. If I had a pimple on my asshole, I might post a picture on 4chan and ask trolls how to go about popping it, in exchange for pictures of the result, because the inability of anybody to identify me would mean I wouldn't have to be embarrassed, or deal with a wife thinking of me as a filthy slob, or a doctor's (probably) redundant instructions and unnecessary advice about hygiene. TLDR:
- People need to make their own decisions without interference.
- Some need anonymity to inform some decisions at least some of the time.
- All need privacy to identify necessary decisions and properly assess these.
- The lack of privacy negatively impacts the quality of assessments and decisions made by an individual.
- The greater the distance in privacy level an influence is made by, the greater the chance that it is erroneous, redundant, or damaging.
- The ability of people to create or obtain profit to sustain themselves and others with depends on the ability to make good decisions.
- The entire human species depends on profitable action to sustain itself.
- Therefore, privacy, freedom, the opportunity for anonymous interaction, and the ability to reveal or restrict information at an individual's own discretion are among the most necessary rights for individuals to have in order to ensure the continuity of the human species
- The pursuit of profit at an individual level sometimes leads to loss, accidentally or by intention, for some or all parties involved
- Outside influence and interference on private decisions are sometimes beneficial when they increase the profit of an enterprise, prevent loss, or positively affect the moral outcome of an enterprise.
- Therefore, the greater the moral importance of an enterprise- the greater the effect it has on happiness, well being, and self-determination, and the greater the number of people so affected- the less privacy that enterprise should be entitled to, in order to facilitate both profitable and positively moral outcomes, as well as prevent loss or negative moral effects.
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